aci

I'm down for 20, can't really lose. I image it will get to be a pain at some point with a bunch of people needing to come over to use it all the time.

Pimpit

If the balancer you are talking about at harbor frieght is their bubble balancer, I wouldn't use one of them on my bike tires. I used to manage a tire shop and we used one and they were crap. But hey what would I know?

cms1172

Just take the wheels to cycle gear and get them balanced for free. Why buy a balancer?

e11charlie

Regardless I am still in. I think the good idea was have the first 30 something pay the $20 and then nothing there after. Either way I dont care its only $20.

katnip

So much for someone trying to do something nice for everyone...you pay more for one tire change at cycle gear, carls, or SRY then he is asking for a one time payment to cover the cost of the machine...regardless its a deal Id pay 20 buck for both my tires mounted...$50 fuck no Ill use to crow bars and save my 50 for 4 or 5 tanks of gas...If everyone is afraid of sue happy people why cant you have everyone that gets there tires mounted sign a waiver for the year...If your not sue happy you shouldnt have a problem signing it..

Some of you let him do your fork seals...whats the difference and I bet it was cheaper then going somewhere else...Ive seen so many different bikes in the garage in the last couple weeks, and he picks them up and fixes them and is out in the garage for hours so he can get their bikes back quickly and some of you are worried about availability... thats to easy make a phone call...chances are hes already out in the garage working on something...

Its only drama if you make it...if you cant be understanding and flexible about getting your tires mounted for next to nothing then great keep paying out the ass...Like I said "SO MUCH FOR SOMEONE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING NICE FOR EVERYONE"

whitedevil

WOW! It seems to be getting worse. Did everyone forget that this is a forum? If you put an idea on here, others will share their opinion. Not everyone will agree on the same thing. It wasn't like a bash on Bailey thread, but some statements were made to share some possible issues. As close as some of us are with others, it does not mean we will always agree, and that is one thing we can all agree on.

Bailey, I think it is a great idea, an awesome gesture. I hope you and a handful of people are able to pull it off. Lord knows with all the damn tires I changed last season it would have been nice to have the machine lol.

DB Cooper

I cannot say how glad I am that I bought my own tire changing/balancing tools. I have been doing my own wheels for the past 7 years and it's well worth it IMO. In the long run you will save money, trips to the stealership, and keeping some assclown from scratching the rims. I don't want to deal with the headache of you scratched my rims up, no they were like that when you brought them in BS situation, it happends all the time.

Pool your cash together and get one and take advantage of it. Get a waiver created so you won't end up on Judge Judy or butt hurt and have at it.

shaner

Honestly I think people are making this out to be a way bigger deal than it should be. Do you really think that the grease monkey at the local shop has any actual training aside from someone showing him once or twice how to mount a tire? I think this is a great idea and I'd be willing to throw down a good chunk of money with you Bailey. And for those worried about knowing how to do it, I have been in the wheel and tire business for many years now and am SEMA certified (same as ASE but for aftermarket) in custom wheels and tires. I've mounted and balanced close to 40 bazillion tires in my day. I'd be glad to help when I can. Then if there is a "liability" issue, go ahead and sue me. I don't have ###t for you to take.

stubby

Who on here is bitching? Even in my post where I said watch out for sue happy people I said it was a great idea.

Fuck, talk about drama and reading comprehension failure. But for as much shit talking and back stabbing that goes on with groups of people, the drama will only get worse.

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

To aid stubby's point. Let's say your www. free lawyer .com site has your waiver and it's just as good as a $1k waiver. Let's say this waiver is SOLID, no loop holes.

Now consider this. I can sue stubby for being too black, too orange. I can sue BRN for having a color scheme I don't like. I can sue a stranger, picking a random name from a hat, for having hair I don't like having never seen them before. In the US you can sue anyone for any reason. EVEN if that person and yourself signed paper work agreeing to certain terms. Even if those terms were met. Even if the waiver says you can damage my wheel, I can still sue you for damaging my wheel.

Now hold on before you go on your it would never hold up in court talk... Of course things that I stated that are ridiculous wouldn't end up being a winning case! But you don't have to win or lose to have lawyer bills. Even if I sign your perfect waiver stating you can damage my wheel then I sue you when you damage my wheel, you will have lawyer fee's. When the judge says Ryan you are dumb, you signed this and he doesn't have to pay you anything. Ok judge you are right, but they still had to pay their lawyer.

That's where the cost of liability will always still exist. Which is another reason why Stubby saying that's why companies have insurance/eat the cost makes sense. They would rather eat the cost time and time again than pay lawyer fee's and have waivers.

So are all these companies dumb for not having waivers and not paying lawyers to fight each person who's wheel they damage or are the minds on BRN more intelligent and have devised a more cost effective solution than all those thousands of companies? Enjoy your waivers & lawyers! And hope that www. free lawyer .com shows up in court with you when someone sues you despite signing your waiver, cause it can happen.

I know some will also say, you don't HAVE to have a lawyer. True! And good luck with that also. I wouldn't be willing to risk it. I imagine after a few court cases none of you would find it worth it either.
Having owned a number of businesses and running through the numbers to be in the motorcycle service/parts business, I just wouldn't do it this way. IF I HAD TO, I'd have a set buy in price with set terms on future cost and refunds or I'd buy the stuff myself and just charge less than the shops, that is if I HAD to do it. Ask Shea if it's worth trying to do this kind of thing in Boise. You learn quick that all these people will still go to the dealers & not support us little guys. Which is why I'd just not do it at all.


LAWYERED!


More questions to address would be

If person A pays $50 towards the changer, how much do they pay to use it when person B put $100 towards the changer? Can person B's friend show up with person B and use it for free? What do other none paying BRN members pay? What if I put $100 towards it use it once then sell my bike?

Those things would come up and need to be agreed on also cause some people might not be as willing to let their $100 go after one use & some people might not think they should pay to use it if they put $100 towards it. Some people might think if you put $10 towards it you should still pay to use it.

I think Don is on to something with having a smaller group. It seems it would be easier to say 8 people put $100 each towards it and they never pay to use it.

Otherwise you end up with all those other questions that would have to be agreed to before people put money in. If you don't you'll have people asking for money back or saying they shouldn't pay as much, etc etc. Then who makes those decisions? If one person wants their money back... who gives them that money back? Who's pocket will it come out of?

IMHO, I'd rather pay for the tire change than try to manage all of that. But if Bailey wants to manage that and get people a better price I'd support him before supporting the shops!

e11charlie

Good points Ryan but the amounts probably sued for in something like this would fall under small claims. When you receive the summons you have the chance to file a counter suit for court costs.

shaner

Holy shit. All this over a tire changer. Wow.

Ryan (and others), I believe there is a simple way around all of this. If you didn't pay into the changer you must pay for ACCESS TO IT. You will not be paying anyone to do it for you. That way if anyone has an issue it is simple. If you paid into the changer then that makes you part owner, therfore you would be sueing yourself if you sued. Makes no sense. If you didn't pay into the changer then you would have paid for access to it and used it yourself with or without the help of others. Again, in the event something happens you are just as responsible and would have to sue yourself. Again, makes no sense.

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

Absolutely but still there will be time, energy, stress, and cost. Even when the paper work is in order cases can still go one way or the other. I'm simply saying that it's still possible to have these costs. There's 100 ways it could work out some would cost you money some won't. The point is... there is a high risk of cost.

For example. I give someone my bike & when I come back I claim both wheels and rotors are damaged and it looks like my gas tank has a new scratch in it. Insurance might consider totaling that... Now it's not small claims. And insurance companies do total bikes with small amounts of damage like that.... Once you put the cost of retail OEM parts and the cost of a shops labor & the time and energy their agents would put into it. It can sometimes be easier for them to total it. If your insurance comes back saying it's totaled, then you COULD sue the company causes the damage for the total value of the vehicle.

It may be rare sure. But more than I'd personally want to take on just because of the chance of if being possible vs. paying another $20-$40 to have a shop do it for me. *shrug*

Bailey I hope you don't take my points personally!! I've considered doing the same thing and I think it's awesome you want to pursue this! I'm just playing devils advocate and stating some reasons I turned away from the idea. Just some things to think about... I'd support you vs. a shop!

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

I totally agree with you Shaner! I'm only asking those questions because if they aren't answered and agreed on BEFORE people get involved it will become a ###t storm!

But still you didn't answer all questions. How much do you pay in to get to use it for free? Is that a set price and no one can pay more or less? What if I put $10 in and someone else puts $100 are we equal owners and both don't pay?
The point of suing is if someone else does the changing for you. Just because I am part owner doesn't mean I can't sue someone else who uses my equipment on my bike and causes damage. Again my point earlier is that anyone can sue anyone else for any reason. I can change my tire on my tire changer at baileys house and if I damage my wheel I can sue bailey. Will i win? That's not the point. I think baileys stress level would still go up even if the case was stupid. And who do you think will have to listen to all the peoples complaints and concerns?? Bailey. I'd be worried taking this on would be stressful for bailey in the long run. Which is the only reason I make all these points. I think it's more to take on than a simple changing of tires.

shaner

Ryan all of your points are very valid. One thing for everyone to remember is that these same issues could apply anytime you work on someone elses bike. If I so much as help a "friend" change his chain and sprockets I could be liable for damages. Point being, if Bailey is already doing bike work for others then this is not a new issue at all and has existed for quite a while. Getting a tire changer wouldn't be any different for him liability wise.

Jermacide

If it were me personally....now granted i have some pretty fucked up opinons but hey if it were me this is what my action would be.

A: buy the damn thing myself
B: gladly accept paypay donations to help with the cost
C: invite TRUSTED friends over to change tires in hopes that they will kick down either some slave labor or a few bucks...
C.2 if in the event a person decides to be a douche and constantly ask for tire changes and not help with labor or funds......just simply axe them from the garage and the relationship.

D: go back to sipping beer and smelling the oh so AWESOME scent of fresh tires.....

I think its great Blizz wants to take on such a task...other will too no doubt....keep in mind there will ALWAYS be the douche and double douche factor....(one douche invites another douche to use and abuse Blizz's willing ness to help a fellow rider). Personally I think its going to ultimatley come down to a few good friends and riding buddies are going to foot the bill for hte gear, James is likely to take on the task of installing and organizing tire changing rallies a few times a year and anytime someone decides to help out its going to be greatly appreciated....

personally i've helped change most all of my tires if they werent done by Scott at MMP....honestly its not the most fun thing to do but its not that hard either....hell...I'm sure James knows that if you spray enough lube in anything and use a long enough, hard enough bar....your bound to get your buisness done.

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

True!! I just hope it doesn't come down to court issues for him. I think it's awesome he's trying to help out and lower costs for people.

Another point someone made was the liability of having at his house. I hate to see that get out of hand... ya know 10pm on Tuesday and 6 bikes come riding up cause someones buddy wants to put new tires on. Then all these strangers are standing around on his property playing with tools and such. If someone got hurt they could sue, if someone was drinking and rode off they could sue, they could steal things, ugh!! Too much for me to handle. But if bailey goes through with it Kudo's to him and I think the BRN community should really appreciate what he's doing for them & support him!

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

I just want to restate the importance of lube....

Bungeeguy

I have a tire machine and balancer but it is in Caldwell bolted into my dads shop. I am thinking about bringing it to my house and getting it bolted in so I can change tires here in Boise. I was thinking about charging $10 a wheel and an extra $5 if you need it balanced (before anyone chimes in about balancing remember dirt bike tires)
What do yo all think about the price?

Addition: For those interested the tire machine I have is a Coats 220. I have used it since I was a kid and my dad gave it to me when he closed his shop.

Attached Images

C-220.jpg (22.5 KB, 6 views)

Hoard

I would probably donate. Friend of mine in Twin Falls just bought one of these...
Slick... slick

r1bran

Seriously? I even know of this guy that got 2 sweet bikes out of a situation just like you described, one street and on race bike. Huh small world

stubby

Who would that be?

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

Stubby stay out of this!

stubby

Well I think is trying to refer to me, even though he knows nothing about my accident. Fact is I didn't sue a damn person though, and my bikes have nothing to do with any of that.

One other little fact as a service business owner. If you charge people to mount/balance tires whether its a one time fee or per tire fee, that constitutes a business in the state of Idaho. That will also require a filing with the state for a business name, along with X amount of liability insurance (amongst other things). I don't do automotive services, but not doing that would also be another loophole around any waivers signed.

Bailey like I said before good idea just too risky for me. Good luck if you do it though.

whitedevil

Seriously? What has gotten into riders? Come on.

BLIZANTHIMUM

alright lets try doing this thing.
my paypal is [email protected]
if there is not enough money contributed by March 31, 2010 all funds will be returned to their owners.
if you contribute through paypal make sure you supply your full name as well as your BRN screen name and phone number so i can keep track of who and how much.
minimum contribution of $20 please.
send the money as a "Personal gift" so paypal doesnt get the 3% fee.

aci

When I get a chance I'll send you mine and Romo's contribution since he doesn't have a paypal.

turbolq4

GOOD EFFIN LORD!!!!!! If you dont want anything to do with this then what the hell are you doin posting in Baileys thread?
Liability this and state law that, if you dont like it then piss off!!!!!


ok, im all better now, i dont have a fancy paypal account but i wanna help, this is an awesome gesture Bailey and i would be glad to help with the cost of the machine

stubby

So I can piss you off. You are one of the dumbfucks that can't read for shit. I said Good Idea, but high liability if you don't like it then ignore me or shut the fuck up. Some people are really fucking stupid. I also said good luck, but I guess that requires too much comprehension for you

Looking out for someone isn't a bad deal, and really I don't want to see something stupid happen to Bailey. Its a fucked up world, and shit happens. Some of us are business owners, and yeah I'll bring up some things he should be aware of. Whether or not he uses the information doesn't matter, however this doesn't concern you, but you feel the need to create more drama.....

whitedevil

You are no different! That is the point. All Stubby did was point a simple fact out, he didn't say not to do it, he didn't bash the idea, yet you are telling him to piss off? What makes you better than anyone on this forum?

Wake up "Riders" if that's what you are. This isn't a debate on right or wrong, someone made a suggestion, good for them, others shared opinions, this isn't a pissing contest. WTF seriously got into all of you? Walk into the bathroom with your favorite magazine and take care of it already, apparently it's been too long since the last time!

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

I don't think you have to have a paypal account to pay someone on paypal anymore... I may be wrong?

I think Bailey can create a "donate" button which can be used for people to make payments that don't have accounts. Of course the forum may not allow the code to be entered. But if may be able to be striped down to just a text link you can copy and paste He might also be able to use the request money feature.

whitedevil

Something that I find funny, the only drama caused is by the poeple that are running mouths err keyboard ninjas!

r1bran

I believe all you need is am email address to send money. A paypal account is a really cool thing to have. I would recommend to anyone that doesnt have an account to take a minute to create one. Paypal also offers a Paypal debit card that you can get for free. It makes your incoming funds transfers immediately available. Anyway get a paypal account. Theres no reason not to.

whitedevil

r1bran

I have seen donate links numberous times on other sites. I dont know that you can get the needed cooperation from the owner of the site to implement. Try that, if not, maybe stubby and don could post the donate icon on ISB.com.

stubby

We might be able to add a page if needed.

Ryan@IdahoSportBikes

It's possible for a vBulletin forum to have those buttons if you allow the code.

r1bran

Voila. Very few issues go unresolved on this site. Thats one of my favorite attributes of it. You can get help with just about anything.

katnip

Im going to start off by saying that I my post was directed towards the negativity I felt while reading the thread and address issues that have been brought up...Instead of trying to find solutions all Im hearing about is the problems and negatives. Nothing is life is perfect but you have to find solutions to get through it...Its like saying motorcycle riding is dangerous so Im not going to do it...rather then finding a solution like good gear and safety courses to lower the risk.

And Stubby when did I say anything about anyone ####hing...I was referring to the majority finding negatives with the idea(good idea) instead of solutions to make it work if its such a great ###king idea...Oh and reading comprehension lets ###king go there...tell me where I call anyone out or direct my statement towards anyone? Cause my post is based on MY interpretation of what Ive read and how I feel...I was not offensive towards anyone...I stated facts, address prior issues about availability, and his credibility...And he's trying to do something nice and help others out so lets hear some ###king solutions...

Don't ###king call me out and try to make me look stupid when I wasent even talking to you nor did I say anything offensive towards anyone but I am now...You want to see a big ###king ####h...cool keep callin me out for bull###t cause thats what this is...This wasnt drama now its been made drama

stubby

First of all nobody is being negative, opinions are being expressed. As for the whining question - the part that was repeated about so much for a good idea - that comes across as whiny. Whether or not that was the intent, I don't know but its text and thats kind of how it reads.

The part in my post about drama was directed at a couple other posts - not yours hence the separate paragraph. The history of BRN, is drama. There is already plenty of it and nothing has been bought yet. Kudos to Bailey though if he is willing to deal with more of this. Seems how history tends to repeat itself on here it will only get worse.

As for the concerns posted about availability, who can/can't use it, costs, etc. Those are valid points to find a solution to help avoid future drama. Unless I'm missing something everything here said, great idea, but I fail to recall one post that says don't do it.