Idaho Wolverine

Spring is comming and so are the MSF classes. Any of you have new guys or girls that need an MSF class?

BeckadarO

Took the beginners class last year. I plan on taking the basic 2 this year as soon as the schedule is posted.
P.S. loved the class

Idaho Wolverine

We usually get the schedual out in late February after our first meeting of the year on base.

If you have already had the beginners course, why would you take it again?

PoltArt

I think it worked like this, but does the customer get a license upon passing the course? (If they have the permit already)

CaptCrash

I believe this is just the usual confusion between the MSF course and Idaho STAR. Idaho STAR offers a Basic Rider Training 2, which is basically the second day of Basic Rider Training.

I would offer that rather than the BRT2 that BeckadarO take the Experienced Rider training which, like the MSF:ERC, you get to ride your own bike.

e11charlie

How much is the experienced rider course?

BeckadarO

Oops your right I did confuse them. I took the STARS basic 1 class last year which was my first season. I was thinking about the basic 2 as a refresher course since it's only my second season riding. I thought about the experienced but not sure my skills are up for it yet.

So to clear up my confusion what is the difference between the MSF and STARS programs?
Thanks

aci

I have two friends that need to take the course. One has never been on one before and the other rode quite a bit this last summer.

CaptCrash

Actually, I mispoke--the BRT2 will let you ride your own ride so if you remember the 2nd day of the BRT you can repeat that on your own bike.

MSF/STAR diff...cirriculum is different, STAR spends a little more time on cornering, and (I'm not sure but I THINK--and Wolverine can tell you for sure) that MSF completion won't get you a license waiver.

BeckadarO

Thanks, I do remember the second day and have practiced some of the courses in a parking lot. I'm just not sure my skills are up for "expert" LOL.

Thanks again BTW I also use your vids as reminders of what to do and what not to do. I love the little voices vid I remember that when I'm out riding and it makes me smile.

Idaho Wolverine

The Stars course and the MSF course is the same with one exception. The STARS course has the rider applying brakes while turning and the MSF has the rider get straight up then brake. Cant say either is wrong, because I do both depending on the situation. All others were the same the last time I looked at a STAR book, which was in 08.

STARS is a great program, it just is not good anywhere but Idaho.
MSF is good nation wide, which is why we do MSF on base. Someone gets a bike then moves, they are still good.

Again STARS is great, just not in Florida or Texas or...........................

Upon completion of the MSF course, you do not need to do a ride evaluation for your licence. Take the writen test at your local DMV and you have your endorsment.

OH, MSF (BRC or ERC) is free on Mountain Home AFB for any DOD employie, active duity, retiree or direct family of these.

CaptCrash

We want to be careful here because there's a couple of caveats--and it's all in the difference between being civilian or military.

If you're a civilian and you take the MSF course you will not be given a license waiver in the state of Idaho.

If you're military you'll want to contact the Department of Transportation "Driver's Services" office and ask for some clarification. They have the ability to give you information on getting a waiver (military only).

The Oregon Cirriculum (used by Idaho STAR) is a great deal different than the BRT--especially when it comes to range exercises.

STAR riders will be more time on the bike and are coached to "Max Braking".

That said the MSF:BRC is good stuff and the way to go for DOD employees who need a safety class for military purposes.

For Civvies in Idaho, if you're looking for training AND the waiver then visit http://www.idahostar.org and after February 8th you'll be able to sign up!

Idaho Wolverine

If you are a spouse or dependent of a DOD employe, you can come to our base and take an MSF course; for free. If you are an unaffiliated civilian, you wont be taking MSF in Idaho.
It is only on base, in Mtn. Home or Gowen Field.

This is much more common here in Mountain Home and that is why I posted this in the "Mountain Home" area instead of the general forum area.

No pissing match here between Oregon, or Idaho, or MSF. We military folks that have to move every so often will get more use out of MSF, thats all I am saying.

No "waiver" is needed, if you are DOD and get an MSF course. You do not need the rider evaluation from the Idaho DOT. Well, not for the last five years since I have been doing the MSF courses here anyway.

Good luck and good riding!!

e11charlie

What about VA card holders?

CaptCrash

That is an excellent question. AND I realize we ignored your first query.

The Idaho STAR Experienced Course is $40, 1 day, ride your own bike.

Wolverine has the info for MSF!

Idaho Wolverine

By VA, I assume you are retired? If you have any kind of Military ID, you can take our MSF courses.

And again, free for the BRC or ERC. Both classes would be on your own bike.

I do not have any contact with the Gowen guys anymore, but they should be able to accomadate you too.

Come on good weather!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

e11charlie

I had my ID card for a couple of years but they decided that it would be best for me to just have a VA card which sucks. Anyway I was just messing about I already knew the answer.

Idaho Wolverine

Get your head out of your butt and go ride!

e11charlie

Butt it is winter and my ears are cold.

sprocketrocket

did you say first meeting this Feb on base? where and when?

katnip

I signed up for the STARs course but where do I sign up for this MSF course? STARs does get you your endorsement right? I dont brake in corners, the first and last time I tried shit like that I went down.

Mrs. Headgehog

The STARS course will help you get a little cheaper discount on your insurance. The class is great for honing in on practicing your skills and the instructors are great when working with you. But you still have to go to the DMV to take the test to get your actual endorsement but you don't have to take the skills test required by the DMV since you took the skills part in STARS. I took the STARS course for beginners last spring and loved it. I finally learned how to use a clutch in one weekend. After trying to drive and stick and kept killing the car. Oh ya and as you said already don't brake in a corners. Someone did that last time in STARS and laid down the bike on a sharp turn, Not good.

katnip

I have already taken my permit written test, I was told if I took the starts course and took in the certificate of completions or what ever they would give me my endorsement...Im just curious about this MSF course cause I was never informed of it when I called about the STARS course

Jermacide

Yes after passing the STARS course and passing the state WRITTEN test...you will receive your endorsment...

katnip

What about this MSF course everyone is speaking of...where do I sign up for that? When I called about the STARs course on base they never brought up anything about MSF course...

Jermacide

No idea....i didnt bother with anything after stars.....went from stars to riding for years alone to riding like a dumbass on the street to too many close calls to a few track days to wake me up to barely riding at all....

katnip

Sounds like quite the adventure

steven32

if you have already taken the written test at the dmv, and then take the stars class, you will get your endorsement. they mail you this little card thing, and you just take that in to the dmv and thats it.

stubby

They probably don't mention it, as most people aren't in the military, and Stars is Idaho's program (of choice?). I haven't taken the MSF course but some say it is better than the stars program

Idaho Wolverine

The STARS course is great for you "Idaho only" types. My people almost always move within a 3-5 year period. If they did Idaho STAR class, they would be screw'd when they moved.

Idaho STAR is great; for Idaho.

steven32

well if you get your endorsement, why does it make a difference?

CaptCrash

Active duty military has to have a safety course--rumor is DOD will be accepting the Team Oregon/Idaho STAR cirriculum soon BUT if you're active duty you'll need the MSF cert.

There is really very, very little difference between STAR and MSF, MSF doesn't spend as much time on corners and you'll get more seat time in STAR.

AND, correct me if I'm wrong, MSF is only available at Mountain Home.

Idaho Wolverine

When our people move, they usually tend to get a licence in the state they move to. Or not, then not that big a deal.

BUT if you go over to Europe or Japan, wherever. You must have an MSF card or you will not ride in those countrys. End of story.

If you are an Idaho resident and take the STAR course, you have no need for an MSF course.

Again, that is why this is in the Mountain Home page since it mainly applies to the MHAFB peep's. And our guard brothers and sisters up there in Boise too.

CaptCrash

Yeah, it's just tough for civilians to understand the DOD's certification process is for active duty and not available to them.

No worries! I say take them both if you can.

Idaho Wolverine

My classes get a good bit of corner time. During an ERC, it is about 1 hour of classroom and 8 hours of butt in the seat time.

I am also pushing my base to get the sportbike riders cousre offered by MSF now. I am having a hell of a time getting saftey and the commander to give us some ramp space for the course set-up.

If we get this passed though, I will be GREAT!!